Proposal talk:A Brazilian Portuguese Wikipedia

Impact?

Some proposals will have massive impact on end-users, including non-editors. Some will have minimal impact. What will be the impact of this proposal on our end-users? -- Philippe 01:13, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

• This is an old proposal that does not give results, not promote anything in the movement Wikimedia and goes against the objectives thereof. It has been widely discussed and denied by the community. Rodrigo Tetsuo Argenton 19:45, 13 September 2009 (UTC)

That's been discussed over and over

That's been discussed over and over, see Wikipedia:Temas recorrentes/Cisão da Wikipédia lusófona. Daimore 18:32, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

The portuguese spoken on Brasil is a bit different from the original Portugal lamguage. However both countries spoken the same language, it could be made a version for brazilian speaks once we have it on english too (see Simple English) -- Proposal

Simple English Wikipedia is not focused on regional differences as this proposed Brazilian Portuguese Wikipedia. American English, British English, Australian English, etc. convive very well at English Wikipedia. Why can't Brazilian Portuguese and European Portuguese do the same at the Portuguese version? Bisbis 19:42, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

The difference between pt and pt-br is large, unlike all varioatoisn of english. For us editors is easy because we get along with one another and we can clear our doubts just asking. But the readers won't do this. And there is the difference of pontuation, capital and tiny letter, words with different meanings and etc. Mizunoryu 02:26, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

I think that this issue is not relevant as the 1991 Ortographic Agreement that bring together the rules between both versions of portuguese has already been approved in the Portuguese Parliament and are going to begin implementation as soon as possible. Therefore, separation in two distinct wikipedias is pure duplication and waste of time. Celso Figueira 213.138.235.240 19:21, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

My English is not very well. Eduardo Rivelli 22:24, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

The Agreement Spelling, will not unify many words. Do not complain or be strange if I miss a few words in English (This is what I speak). As: Eduardo Rivelli 22:24, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

• Terremoto (pt-br) - terramoto (pt-pt)

• DNA (pt-br) - ADN (pt-pt)

• Mouse (pt-br) - Rato (pt-pt)

• Site (pt-br) - Site/Sítio (pt-pt)

• Scanner ou escâner (pt-br) - Scanner/Digitalizador (pt-pt)

• Esporte e desporto (pt-br) - (Just) Desporto (pt-pt)

• Estados Unidos e EUA (pt-br) - Estados Unidos, Estados Unidos da América, EUA, América do Norte* (pt-pt)

• Holanda e Países Baixos (not usual "Países Baixos", usually it's "Holanda") (pt-br) - Países Baixos (sometimes "Holanda") (pt-pt)

• Rugby ou Rúgbi (pt-br) - Râguebi (somentimes Rugby) (pt-pt)

• Blog (pt-br) - Blog/Blogue (pt-pt)

• Estoniano ou estônio (pt-br) - Estónio (pt-pt)

• Letônia (pt-br) - Letónia (pt-pt)

• Econômico (pt-br) - Económico (pt-pt)

• Estônia (pt-br) - Estónia (pt-pt)

• Cassino (pt-br) - Casino (pt-pt)

• Sorvete (pt-br) - Gelado (pt-pt)

• AIDS (pt-br) - SIDA (pt-pt)

• RNA (pt-br) - ARN (pt-pt)

• Arquitetônico (pt-br) - Arquitectónico (pt-pt)

• Fotônica (pt-br) - Fotónica (pt-pt)

• Nêutron (pt-br) - Neutrão (pt-pt)

• Quadrinhos or História em quadrinhos (pt-br) - Banda Desenhada (pt-pt)

• Metrô (pt-br) - Metropolitano e/ou metro (pt-pt)

• Vênus (pt-br) - Vénus (pt-pt)

• Ônibus (pt-br) - Autocarro (pt-pt)

• Rodovia (pt-br) - Autoestrada (pt-pt)

• Trem (pt-br) - Comboio (pt-pt)

• Ônibus espacial (pt-br) - Vaivém espacial (pt-pt)

• Karatê or Caratê (pt-br) - Karaté (sometimes Caraté) (pt-pt)

• Comitê (pt-br) - Comité (pt-pt)

• Layout (pt-br) - Layout (ocasionally Leiaute) (pt-pt)

• Amsterdã (pt-br) - Amsterdão (pt-pt)

• Roterdã (pt-br) - Roterdão (pt-pt)

• Armênia (pt-br) - Arménia (pt-pt)

• Polonês (pt-br) - Polaco (pt-pt)

• Amazônia (pt-br) - Amazónia (pt-pt)

• República Tcheca (pt-br) - República Checa (pt-pt)

• Tcheco (a) (pt-br) - Checo (pt-pt)

• Iugoslávia (pt-br) - Jugoslávia (pt-pt)

• Islã (pt-br) - Islão (pt-pt)

• Copenhague (pt-br) - Copenhaga (pt-pt)

• Helsinque (pt-br) - Helsínquia (pt-pt)

• Moscou (pt-br) - Moscovo (pt-pt)

• Língua de sinais (pt-br) - Língua gestual (pt-pt)

• Zimbábue (pt-br) - Zimbabwe ou Zimbabué (pt-pt)

• Holandês (pt-br) - Holandês (ocasionally Neerlandês) (pt-pt)

• Madri (pt-br) - Madrid (pt-pt)

• Galícia (pt-br) - Galiza (pt-pt)

• La Coruña (pt-br) - A Corunha (pt-pt)

• New Hampshire (pt-br) - Nova Hampshire (pt-pt)

• Nova Jersey (pt-br) - Nova Jérsia (pt-pt)

• Dakota do Sul (pt-br) - Dacota/Dakota do Sul (pt-pt)

• Dakota do Norte (pt-br) - Dacota/Dakota do do Norte (pt-pt)

• Vodka (pt-br) - Vodca/Vodka (pt-pt)

• Nova York (pt-br) - Nova Iorque (pt-pt)

• Jersey (pt-br) - Jérsei/Jérsia (pt-pt)

• York (pt-br) - Iorque (pt-pt)

• fato (pt-br) - facto (pt-pt)

• eletrônica (pt-br) - electrónica (pt-pt)

Are 1361 words that the two versions the Portuguese (BR and PT) is different, or more. The Portuguese of Brazil is very very very very different that the Portuguese of Portugal (may believe it is good believe tie). Eduardo Rivelli 22:24, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

Will be very good when I have a Brazilian Portuguese Wikipedia. It will be very good both for Brazil and for Portugal (The Brazilians will enjoy, seeing things only in Brazilian Portuguese on Wikipedia in Portuguese and Brazilian Portuguese will "fight" with less Brazilians (they will be in the Wikipedia in Portuguese and Brazilian Portuguese will be in Wikipedia in the Wikipedia in Portuguese or European Portuguese. The Portuguese will stay in the Wikipedia in Portuguese with its former colonies, except Brazil (because the Portuguese of Brazil is very different from that of Portugal and former colonies, can believe that). (the number of Brazilians is higher than the Portuguese in the world). The Portuguese of Brazil is very different to the Portuguese of Portugal, Angola and other former Portuguese colonies. While the Portuguese of Portugal is not as different that the Portuguese from Angola, Green Cape and other former Portuguese colonies, even. Eduardo Rivelli 23:05, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

O site pode ser: http://pt-br.wikipedia.org 189.4.199.10 01:05, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

The differences you've mentioned don't sound significantly greater than the differences between British and American English. --Tango 01:48, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

The list above is rather short. A language specific project works as long as there is a large group working in it. Avoid the balcanization of the Portugese speaking community and try on-the-fly translation like it is done at the Chinese Wikipedia (zh, zh-hans, zh-hant, zh-cn, zh-hk, zh-sg, zh-tw) or at the Serbian Wikipedia (Latin/Cyrillic alphabet). --32X 14:13, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

Request for new language

For those in support, please have a look at m:requests for new languages, for current policy, produre, and organization of processing new requests for new languages. Dedalus 13:53, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

As long as Brazilian Portuguese is not considered a separate language in the ISO-639-3, a request like this will be denied under the existing policy. Thanks, GerardM 15:02, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

You do not know how the Portuguese of Brazil is different to that of Portugal (it is very different). You do not know, but I know same. It is many different words, accents and local expressions. The Portuguese in Brazil can be more different to that of Portugal than the American English and British English. Eduardo Rivelli 17:44, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Portuguese and Brazilians cannot live well in the Wikipedia in Portuguese. Eduardo Rivelli 17:44, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

The Argentine Spanish is very different to the Spanish of Spain. And the Spanish of Spain is not so different that Spanish in Peru, Panama, Venezuela, etc.. Eduardo Rivelli 17:44, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

It will be very good for Brazilians (mostly) to edit Wikipedia in en, as in Portuguese. Because the Brazilian will not encounter something in Portuguese from Portugal. Eduardo Rivelli 17:44, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

And also because the pt-wiki, you can become more or Brazilian Portuguese. Eduardo Rivelli 17:59, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

If there is a Wikipedia in Arabic in Egypt, why can not exist in the Wikipedia Brazilian Portuguese. In pt-wiki has many conflicts because of differences language between Brazil and Portugal. 189.4.199.10 17:13, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

I want peace, without conflicts. Very easy to say that the case is difficult. Eduardo Rivelli 17:44, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

If you think of this topic more globally you'll find many nations that speak a given language differently than others. The difference between Brazilian Portuguese and the one spoken in Portugal is most likely not the largest one. If you split the portuguese wikipedia in two you'll propably have to split many other wikipedias in several parts. German for example is spoken in 7 different countries - all of them having more or less different grammar, accents, words etc. (7.000 Austrian-German words alone) The german wikipedia has as well many conflicts regarding the language - nevertheless it would be fatal to split it. In the long run it would reduce the quality of wikipedia and IMHO propably lead to the end of wikipedia. --Sebastian.Dietrich 15:22, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

If there is a Coca-Cola Brazil, Google Brazil, Yahoo! Answers Brazil,etc., because it can not exist in the wikipédia en Brazil? Is asking too? Eduardo Rivelli 23:53, 21 August 2009 (UTC) You can create Wikipedias to other countries, not have so much trouble. Eduardo Rivelli 23:53, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

Even with the new ortographic agreement which makes the brazilian portuguese closer to the portuguese one, both languages are very different, they should YES make a new one. We feel reading the portuguese wiki as a british does reading the english one. Even being the same language, the wiki is far more focused on Portugal's portuguese, as is the english one with american english. Luizmarcelino01 16:37, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Bad Idea

This proposal makes me angry, this is a really bad idea, I think you don't understand the philosophy of Wikimedia. We should work together to improve wikipedia content, not split in half and start working separately. We will have twice the work we have right now. Everybody in Brazil can understand pt-pt. Some people might not like, but YES! we can understand. This proposal seems like those stupid youtube wars among brazilians and Portuguese people.

--Bozomal 02:19, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

I propouse to unificate Galego & Portugués

Pushing things people don't like doesn't quite seem to go with the Wikiphilosophy. 85.246.21.93 16:42, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

Em português mesmo

Parem com isso, não é saudável para a Wikipédia essa sisão, depois teremos que ficar transportando as informações de uma comunidade para a outra, ridículo, não sei qual o problema de ter pt-pt e pt-br em um mesmo artigo, dá para entender, não há tantas diferenças assim. Rodrigo Tetsuo Argenton 17:11, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Movido de Wikipedia Brazilian Portuguese

My English is not very well. Eduardo Rivelli 01:23, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

The Agreement Spelling, will not unify many words. Do not complain or be strange if I miss a few words in English (This is what I speak). As: Eduardo Rivelli 01:23, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

• Terremoto (pt-br) - terramoto (pt-pt)

• DNA (pt-br) - ADN (pt-pt)

• Mouse (pt-br) - Rato (pt-pt)

• Site (pt-br) - Sítio (pt-pt)

• Scanner ou escâner (pt-br) - Digitalizador (pt-pt)

• Esporte e desporto (pt-br) - (Just) Desporto (pt-pt)

• Estados Unidos e EUA (pt-br) - Estados Unidos da América (pt-pt)

• Holanda e Países Baixos (pouco "Países Baixos", fala-se mais "Holanda") (pt-br) - Países Baixos (pt-pt)

• Rugby ou Rúgbi (pt-br) - Râguebi (pt-pt)

• Blog (pt-br) - Blogue (pt-pt)

• Estoniano ou estônio (pt-br) - Estónio (pt-pt)

• Letônia (pt-br) - Letónia (pt-pt)

• Econômico (pt-br) - Económico (pt-pt)

• Estônia (pt-br) - Estónia (pt-pt)

• Cassino (pt-br) - Casino (pt-pt)

• Sorvete (pt-br) - Gelado (pt-pt)

• AIDS (pt-br) - SIDA (pt-pt)

• RNA (pt-br) - ARN (pt-pt)

• Arquitetônico (pt-br) - Arquitectónico (pt-pt)

• Fotônica (pt-br) - Fotónica (pt-pt)

• Nêutron (pt-br) - Neutrão (pt-pt)

• Quadrinhos ou História em quadrinhos (pt-br) - Banda Desenhada (pt-pt)

• Metrô (pt-br) - Metropolitano e/ou metro (pt-pt)

• Vênus (pt-br) - Vénus (pt-pt)

• Ônibus (pt-br) - Autocarro (pt-pt)

• Rodovia (pt-br) - Autoestrada (pt-pt)

• Trem (pt-br) - Comboio (pt-pt)

• Ônibus espacial (pt-br) - Vaivém espacial (pt-pt)

• Karatê e/ou Caratê (pt-br) - Karaté and/or Caraté (pt-pt)

• Comitê (pt-br) - Comité (pt-pt)

• Layout (pt-br) - Leiaute (pt-pt)

• Amsterdã (pt-br) - Amsterdão (pt-pt)

• Roterdã (pt-br) - Roterdão (pt-pt)

• Armênia (pt-br) - Arménia (pt-pt)

• Polonês (pt-br) - Polaco (pt-pt)

• Amazônia (pt-br) - Amazónia (pt-pt)

• República Tcheca (pt-br) - República Checa (pt-pt)

• Tcheco (a) (pt-br) - Checo (pt-pt)

• Iugoslávia (pt-br) - Jugoslávia (pt-pt)

• Islã (pt-br) - Islão (pt-pt)

• Copenhague (pt-br) - Copenhaga (pt-pt)

• Helsinque (pt-br) - Helsínquia (pt-pt)

• Moscou (pt-br) - Moscóvia (pt-pt)

• Língua de sinais (pt-br) - Língua gestual (pt-pt)

• Zimbábue (pt-br) - Zimbabwe ou Zimbabué (pt-pt)

• Holandês (pt-br) - Neerlandês (pt-pt)

• Madri (pt-br) - Madrid (pt-pt)

• Galícia (pt-br) - Galiza (pt-pt)

• La Coruña (pt-br) - A Corunha (pt-pt)

• New Hampshire (pt-br) - Nova Hampshire (pt-pt)

• Nova Jersey (pt-br) - Nova Jérsei (pt-pt)

• Dakota do Sul (pt-br) - Dacota do Sul (pt-pt)

• Dakota do Norte (pt-br) - Dacota do do Norte (pt-pt)

• Vodka (pt-br) - Vodca (pt-pt)

• Nova York (pt-br) - Nova Iorque (pt-pt)

• Jersey (pt-br) - Jérsei (pt-pt)

• York (pt-br) - Iorque (pt-pt)

Are 1361 words that the two versions the Portuguese (BR and PT) is different, or more. The Portuguese of Brazil is very very very very different that the Portuguese of Portugal (may believe it is good believe tie). Eduardo Rivelli 01:23, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Will be very good when I have a Brazilian Portuguese Wikipedia. It will be very good both for Brazil and for Portugal (The Brazilians will enjoy, seeing things only in Brazilian Portuguese on Wikipedia in Portuguese and Brazilian Portuguese will "fight" with less Brazilians (they will be in the Wikipedia in Portuguese and Brazilian Portuguese will be in Wikipedia in the Wikipedia in Portuguese or European Portuguese. The Portuguese will stay in the Wikipedia in Portuguese with its former colonies, except Brazil (because the Portuguese of Brazil is very different from that of Portugal and former colonies, can believe that). (the number of Brazilians is higher than the Portuguese in the world). The Portuguese of Brazil is very different to the Portuguese of Portugal, Angola and other former Portuguese colonies. While the Portuguese of Portugal is not as different that the Portuguese from Angola, Green Cape and other former Portuguese colonies, even. Eduardo Rivelli 01:23, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

O site pode ser: http://pt-br.wikipedia.org/wiki/ Eduardo Rivelli 01:23, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

You do not know how the Portuguese of Brazil is different to that of Portugal (it is very different). You do not know, but I know same. It is many different words, accents and local expressions. The Portuguese in Brazil can be more different to that of Portugal than the American English and British English. Eduardo Rivelli 17:45, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Portuguese and Brazilians can not live well in the Wikipedia in Portuguese. Eduardo Rivelli 17:45, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

The Argentine Spanish is very different to the Spanish of Spain. And the Spanish of Spain is not so different that Spanish in Peru, Panama, Venezuela, etc.. Eduardo Rivelli 17:45, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

It will be very good for Brazilians (mostly) to edit Wikipedia in en, as in Portuguese. Because the Brazilian will not encounter something in Portuguese from Portugal. Eduardo Rivelli 17:45, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

And also because the pt-wiki, you can become more or Brazilian Portuguese. Eduardo Rivelli 18:01, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

If there is a Wikipedia in Arabic in Egypt, why can not exist in the Wikipedia Brazilian Portuguese. In pt-wiki has many conflicts because of differences language between Brazil and Portugal. 189.4.199.10 17:14, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Wikipedia will lose some users (or even more) if you are in Wikipedia Brazilian Portuguese. Eduardo Rivelli 18:27, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

I want peace, without conflicts. Very easy to say that the case is difficult. Eduardo Rivelli 17:45, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Só uma coisa nesta lista há várias mentiras. New York e Nova Iorque, por exemplo, são aceitos no Brasil e desculpe, mas não senti nenhuma dificuldade em ler e entender pt-pt, mesmo sendo brasileiro. Acho que esse assunto é batido e não cabe ao Strategic Plannig esse tipo de discussão que não acresce em nada o movimento Wikimedia. Rodrigo Tetsuo Argenton 17:50, 27 September 2009 (UTC)